Author Chats
Historian Wesley G. 菲尔普斯追寻LGBTQ平等之路
June 13, 2023
It’s been 20 years since the U.S. Supreme Court decriminalized consensual gay sex with its landmark decision in Lawrence v. Texas，为2015年同性婚姻合法化奠定了基础 Obergefell v. Hodges.
In his absorbing new book, Before Lawrence v. Texas: The Making of a Queer Social Movement, history professor Wesley G. Phelps of the University of North Texas takes readers back to the decades-long effort to strike down the Lone Star State’s sodomy law, which was often used to prevent members of the LGBTQ community from obtaining certain jobs, housing, and government assistance. 
“I am really interested in the history of how democracy works at the local level and how marginalized people have struggled to be a part of the democratic experiment in America,菲尔普斯谈到了他决定写基础工作的决定, activism, and litigation that made Lawrence possible.
What inspired you to write Before Lawrence v. Texas?
My first book, A People’s War on Poverty是关于休斯敦的民权和反贫困活动. [It involves] Louie Welch, the mayor from 1964 to 1973 — pretty much the whole scope of the book. He ran for mayor again in 1985 and had one of those hot mic moments when he was about to go on a newscast and did not know that they had already gone live. He was joking with the camera guy about his plan to end the AIDS crisis in Houston. 他说，他计划的第一点是“射杀同性恋者”.“我在为我的论文做研究时偶然发现了这个故事, 我只是想在某个时候我应该回去重新审视它.
After my first book came out in 2014, I [looked into that] incident and discovered that [Welch’s] statement was uttered amidst a vicious battle in Houston over a nondiscrimination ordinance that the city council had passed protecting gay and lesbian workers in municipal employment. 我写了一篇关于性政治的文章. As I was writing, I learned that Texas’s sodomy law, the Homosexual Conduct Law, [had been in effect] since 1973.
I thought, what an interesting coincidence that this battle over the nondiscrimination ordinance happened in the precise window where the sodomy law had been ruled unconstitutional. I was not even aware that it was still in effect until 2003, when I read Dale Carpenter’s book, Flagrant Conduct: The Story of Lawrence v. Texas.
I thought, we have got a great history of Lawrence. But what are the cases that came before Lawrence? 这正是我写这本书的灵感来源.
Talk about how you conducted your research.
我和很多历史学家一样——反向研究. The first case I came across was Baker v. Wade, which was filed in 1979. I discovered there were records of this case in Austin at the [Dolph] Briscoe Center [for American History]. As I was doing research there, 我找到了一个叫德州人权基金会的组织的记录. They are the ones who launched Baker v. Wade, 我找到了一页又一页的法律文件, as far as I know, researchers had not really used before. 我从未见过有人引用这些材料.
[From the Baker case], I found Judge Jerry Buchmeyer’s decision [in 1982] and the Fifth Circuit Court of Appeals’ ruling from 1985. 案件双方都提交了法律摘要. There were transcribed depositions in there. There were letters and memos that passed between the Texas Human Rights Foundation and Don Baker and other activists. Not only that, 但这些法律摘要的草稿也被丢弃了, which allowed me some insight into how this constitutional argument evolved over time.
我发现了一个1970年的案子叫做 Buchanan v. Batchelor, [involving] Alvin Buchanan, who was arrested in a quasi-public place but nevertheless filed a constitutional challenge against the Texas sodomy law.
我想，肯定有更早的案例. 我能找到的最早的病例是1867年的. What makes cases before Buchanan (不同的)是，确实没有关于宪法的争论. 关于法律的模糊性存在争论. A lot of times, 那时人们会因为违反国家鸡奸法而被捕, 法律的语言非常模糊，它没有真正定义犯罪. In the 19th century, the sodomy law was stated as the abominable and detestable crime against nature. A lot of defendants would say, “What is that?”
被告被撤销了对他们的指控, or their cases were thrown out by judges, 谁同意[鸡奸法]没有明确规定犯罪. 德州立法机构花了一段时间才做出具体规定. But in 1943, it did. It wrote a new law very specifically criminalizing oral and anal sex among everyone — members of the same sex, opposite sex, married, unmarried. It was illegal for everyone.
从那时起，我们开始看到法院支持判决, 因为法律有更明确的定义. It was not really until 1970, with Buchanan, that we got constitutional arguments. So, that is really the focus of my book.
从那里，看到这条几乎是直线的线真是太神奇了 Buchanan to Baker in 1979 to Morales v. Texas in 1989 to England v. City of Dallas in 1990. It was really interesting to see the evolution of that constitutional argument all the way up through Lawrence.
告诉我们一个你在写这本书时发现的个人故事.
One was [about] Don Baker, who seemed to be an extremely remarkable individual. 他出生在达拉斯，在德克萨斯州的橡树崖长大. 他的祖父是神召会的牧师. Don Baker grew up in the Assemblies of God church and had internalized its messages about homosexuality. His sister, Maggie Watt, told me that Don would often go to prayer lines and beg to be cured of his sexual orientation.
这种情况一直持续到他的高中和大学时代. 他还没有和别人发生过性关系, 但他对自己的欲望感到内疚. He tells the story of sinning in
有一天，我在[德克萨斯大学]的学生会里看足球比赛. 他是一个超级足球迷，另一个学生走近他. 唐觉得这个人可能会发生什么事. They went to the restroom, but Don just could not go through with it; he was too guilt-ridden.
So, he dropped out of UT and started seeing a psychotherapist at the time who told him, “Look, 如果你想治愈你的同性恋, maybe you should join the military.这似乎是一个奇怪的选择，但他就是这么做的.
He served in the Navy for four years and never had a single sexual experience there. This was between 1968 and 1972. He loved the military. 我猜这让他忘记了性取向. 但当他1972年回到德克萨斯州时，(他的罪恶感)又开始了. 他考虑过结束自己的生命——事情变得那么糟糕. 他搬到了纽约，在那里读了教育学研究生.
[Don] discovered that there were gay and lesbian people in New York who were not the monsters that he thought they were. 他们是普通人，只是碰巧是同性恋. (他)开始了出柜和接受自己的过程. He moved back to Dallas. 他向家人出柜了，家人都很支持他. He became a substitute teacher at an elementary school in the same town he grew up in.
[Later,] the superintendent of Dallas schools announced that if there were any gay or lesbian teachers in his district, they would be fired immediately. This really sparked something in Don. Over the next year, he decided that he needed to be a public activist about this issue. He went back to get a graduate degree at Southern Methodist University in Dallas. While he was there, the Texas Human Rights Foundation approached him about being the plaintiff in Baker v. Wade, which he agreed to do. 这意味着他将有一种从未经历过的公共生活.
He was the public face of this case, 引起了媒体的极大关注, and he handled it beautifully. Don Baker was a born educator, and he knew from the very beginning that this case was not just about a discriminatory law. It was not just about getting rid of this [sodomy] law that targeted gays and lesbians. It was about eliminating the criminal stigma from the lives of regular gay and lesbian people.
If you start thinking about all the things you could not do in the state of Texas if you were gay or lesbian, like becoming a police officer, lawyer, doctor, or even hairdresser, you needed a license and had to sign a form [declaring that you upheld] all of Texas’s state laws. For gay and lesbian people, you were either shut out from those professions or had to commit perjury to get those jobs.
但歧视远不止于此. 你可能因为是同性恋而被法律拒绝提供住房. 你可能会被法律拒绝食品券援助. You were subject to police harassment. 你们受到同胞的骚扰和暴力, 都是因为这项法律给你的生活加上了犯罪的污名.
Don Baker understood that and was able to explain that the Texas sodomy law was not just about police officers breaking down the doors of people in their bedrooms having sex. 这项法律是为了给猖獗的歧视提供正当理由. Unfortunately, Don Baker died in 2000 from cancer, but his sister Maggie really offered me a glimpse into what he was like as a person.
我知道你正在推出一个10集的互补播客， Queering the Lone State. Talk a bit about it.
Our official release date is June 22. When I first submitted the book, I turned in a manuscript that was about 170,000 words, (出版商)告诉我，我必须把它缩减到110页,000 words. 我不得不从书中删去很多东西.
A lot of times, 历史学家使用这些额外的材料，并将其作为期刊文章发表, book chapters, or essays. I did a little bit of that, but I thought [having a podcast] might be more interesting for people who don’t read historical journals or books.
每一集取书中的一个案例, 然后给出了比我在书中所能提供的更多的细节. 我们会听到那些真正参与其中的人的声音. In fact, our first episode is about Buchanan v. Batchelor.
